Season 3 - Episode 12 | Holistic Healthcare - Blending Eastern Wisdom and Western Medicine: Dr. Huong Nguyen (Vietnam)

What does holistic healthcare truly mean, and how can it transform patient outcomes?

To wrap up our podcast Season 3 today, Dr. Ramesh meets with Dr. Huong Nguyen, a distinguished medical doctor and researcher from Vietnam, who shares her journey of blending Eastern tradition with modern Western medical practices to create a holistic approach to healthcare. With decades of research and practice, Dr. Huong offers profound insights into treating complex diseases such as Parkinson's and stroke, addressing not only the bio-medical, but also the mental, emotional and social aspects of a patient's well-being.

Dr. Huong’s philosophy extends beyond individual treatment to building sustainable healthcare communities. She speaks passionately about co-founding the Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine, where she mentors students and integrates cutting-edge technology with Eastern wisdom. Her commitment to education, entrepreneurship and holistic healthcare underscores the importance of collaboration, both locally and internationally, to improve patient outcomes and advance medical research.

3 Key Insights from this Podcast:

1. Holistic Healthcare Redefined – Dr. Huong combines Eastern and Western approaches for more comprehensive treatment of complex diseases, as mental, emotional and social factors play critical roles in a patient’s overall well-being with optimised recovery process.
2. Empowering Future Generations – Mentoring students, young doctors and researchers leverages education and collaboration to advance healthcare.
3. Building Sustainable Communities – Get inspired by Dr. Huong’s vision for creating healthcare communities that foster international collaboration to develop new medical solutions that benefit human health.

Host: Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra, Author, Podcast Host, Founder of Talent Leadership Crucible & Founder of Impact Velocity

Guest Speaker: Dr. Huong T. T. Nguyen, Co-Founder of Dinh Tien Hoang Medical Research Institute (DTHIM)

See you next month, where Dr. Ramesh will kick off our brand new Season 4 of heart-to-heart talks with inspiring Changemakers from all around the world, especially Asia. You can look forward to hearing from a leading advocate for women in Singapore, Ms Koh Yan Ping, CEO of the Singapore Council of Women's Organizations (SCWO), who champions for the empowerment of women, to make a positive impact on society. 

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Transcript

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 00:00

Welcome to the Thriving in the Age of Disruption podcast series. Dr. Huong, we met some time ago, and I've been intrigued by your background and experience. I wanted to have a chat with you about your life, and so perhaps we can start off with you sharing with us a little bit about yourself.

Dr. Huong 00:18

Yes. Hi. Dr Ramesh it’s really nice for me to be in the podcast. My name is the Huong. The full name is Huong Nguyen but in Vietnam, we usually go as Huong or Dr. Huong. I graduated from Hanoi Medical University 20 years ago. After graduation, I also work for Hanoi Medical University in Physiology department as a lecture and researcher. Working in Hanoi Medical University, I also feel that I need to develop myself in the professional channel, so I look for international Master Degree in Thailand, in my university, I focus on the aspect of medicine, and I found that in very interesting when we see the patient in holistic way, not only in terms of biology or physiology, but also in terms of social aspect, the person as a whole so we can cope with the patient needs more effectively. And after one year in Thailand, I come back to Vietnam and continue working in physiology department until now, but then I also think that I need to work more for my PhD to understand the disease phenomenon in Vietnam. All Asians, are different compared to European or American. We found out in my master thesis that the disease model, both menopause and women in Vietnam, is a very much different compared to other country, especially compared to European or Caucasian women. So that motivated me to go further for study and develop my PhD. Then I choose the Karolinksky Institute in Sweden for my PhD, and at the same time with the study in Sweden, but I still continue working in Hanoi Medical University, because I follow the sandwich model, both working and studying, and I collect the data in Vietnam and do the lab work and defense in Sweden. So, I finished my PhD in 2012. After I got my PhD, I also would like to go further with research. So, I found the Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine with the hope that I can support other students, or other young doctor who are the younger generation, go abroad to study like me and come back to serve the country in the better way. So that is the how I also have a Dinh Tien Hoang Institute medicine where we focus on the breakthrough to tie combination between Western and Eastern medicine. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 03:12

Oh, lovely. Thank you so much. So, it's really exciting for me, because I have with me today, a doctor, an academic, a researcher, someone who's an entrepreneur as well. Then so you've gone through all these different phases in your journey, I feel that one of the key mindsets that is necessary in today's world of disruption is the entrepreneurial mindset. And when I listen to you and your journey on how you started off studying to do medicine, and then how you did your research, and you started your institute, and you continue now with your research, it's clear for me that you are someone who has an entrepreneurial mindset, and I define our entrepreneurial mindset as one where you are being resourceful. That is, if you have a problem, you know how to define the right problem, and you go to solving it. Two, is that you're able to deal with uncertainty and manage risk. And three, is actually that you are creating value, not just for yourself, but for others, and not just financial but also non-financial value. So when you look at your own journey, how is it that you were always looking at what's next and what's next like this entrepreneurial mindset, share a little bit about what can you see about yourself and what inspired you and supported you to navigate this journey. 

Dr. Huong 04:37

When I grow up, I just the simple life, but really like to help people surround and I share the things I have. For example, if I see the children nearby, they could not speak foreign language, then I just come to my house and teach them how to speak foreign language. When I come back from Thailand, I also see that, “Oh, when I go out of the country, I see so much new things and interesting.” And I come back to my university, I also start telling that with my students, that if we study everything together in English, then we can learn new things from reading book, from the literature reviews, from the new study. So, we just form the small group of students, with four students at that time, and then we start sharing what is interesting together. So, we start the journey with the friendship and science for health with the first four students, we expand the group into eight students, and we also expanded every year. So now we for FSH community with not more than 100 but we support each other when they are undergraduate.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 06:02

As you're speaking, I can hear how, number one, you're motivated by wanting to make a difference or help people, and so that's what had you reach out to, whether it is the children in your neighborhood or your classmates. And number two is that you are also someone who can see new things and opportunity as opportunities, and you learn them and you come back to apply them. So that's an interesting entrepreneurial trait, because entrepreneurs are good at spotting opportunities and in being able to apply that for the situation that they are in. And the last piece that you talked about was your ability to collaborate with people, and how you develop that network and community from four students to about 100 students, as you look now in your own journey of running your medical center, can you share a little bit more? 

Dr. Huong 06:57

Actually, we have the Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine, where we focus on the breakthrough of combination between Eastern and Western, not only medicine, but also Eastern and Western mindset. So, after 12 years up to date, we can have a certain technology to deal with difficult-to-treat disease. We call difficult-to-treat disease, it means that the disease either difficult to diagnose, or if we can diagnose, but we cannot have a solution to deal with the disease, for example, like Parkinsons ALS, or even we have a solution, but it's not the optimum for that patient. For example, we already have a certain way to deal with the patient with stroke, but still, a lot of stroke patients, they still not yet get that optimum treatment, and still get a lot of paralysed difficulty in life. We deal with such difficult cases, and we find the solution to help those patients who could not get benefit from the available therapy, from the available solution, from the available medicine. We also set up the Dinh Tien Hoang Medical Clinic where we can help those patients directly get their life back apart from the Institute, where we can give the training, where we can do the research, but we also have the Dinh Tien Hoang Medical Clinic where we can give the treatment for the patient with difficult-to-treat.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 08:40

So your treatment is holistic, because part of it is dealing with their mindset about their own recovery and the treatment, and then part of it is the challenge of the available medical interventions right now for their disease.

Dr. Huong 08:55

Yes, this combination of many things. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 08:59

A lot of people also suffer from Diabetes, and that requires a lifestyle change. And in fact, that's the hardest for people to do right most instances. And so, I guess being able to address it from that holistic view and to deal with their readiness to embrace the change that they need to make is also an important part of a medical intervention. 

Dr. Huong 09:24

Yes.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 09:24

And how big is your team?

Dr. Huong 09:26

The team we have two co-founders for Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine. But then we have a lot of other people in the teams in the Institute of Medicine, we have a Chairman who is the Minister of Science and Technology. When he sees our potential, he supports us very much as the advisor. But then later on, we have him as our Chairman. Yes, and also in the Institute, we have a different research group, strong research group. I’m responsible for the research group, which is my PhD in Sweden. But also, I’m responsible for developing the new technology in difficult-to-treat disease. And other colleagues focus on different subjects, like Diabetes. We have another group with Cardiovascular disease, and we have another group with Neurology. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 10:31

Oh, wow, it's very extensive. 

Dr. Huong 10:34

Then we have the team leader. So, for example, in the research group, I am the team leader. In my team, I have a PhD student. For example, last year I have three PhDs who already graduated from Hanoi medical school who take part in the study in the Institute of Medicine for their research. But they are Hanoi medical student, PhD student, who are Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine and 100 Medical University in collaboration, because they have Hanoi Medical University, they have a student at all levels, from undergraduate and postgraduate. But in Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine, we have a research project, and also, we have a network of experts in other countries, like in Sweden, in Estonia, in England. They support with the exchange of information and data and best practices.

Dr. Huong 11:30

So that is the how we build up the team. So apart from the PhD student, we also have a master student. We have an undergraduate student. We support individually for students to customise their need. For example, in Dinh Tien Hoang Institute of Medicine, when we support for undergraduate students, we build their capacity from zero to know-how to do the research and then actually participate in the research and also learn how to get the scholarship to go abroad and how to choose the best university in medicine to study in identifying institute of medicine. We can help for a certain number of undergraduate students after they graduate, they can get scholarship to other country. For example, we have a student scholarship to John Hopkins and also to HUST University.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 12:26

Wow. Yeah, really great. So, thank you for sharing this with me. When I met you, you had shared with me that your grandparents were entrepreneurs and so were your parents. And do you find that was also part of how you developed this entrepreneurial mindset?

Dr. Huong 12:42

Yeah, that is very interesting question. Maybe I got that heritage from my grandparents, because when I was born, I just thought, I am a lecturer. I am the medical doctor. But when it come up, how to transfer our research result to help more patient, how to transfer the research capacity to other students so they can get the scholarship like me or the patient, they can get the therapy in a best price and in better condition. Then that lead me to the way to be entrepreneur in Sweden, after my defense, my supervisor told me that, “Oh, your defense is so nice, and I found out that you have an instinct as an entrepreneur.” At that time, I still not realise what does it mean. But now I understand, “Oh, she's so great that she sees that in me, and when I also look back our family life, I see that, “Oh, my grandparents, both from my mother's side and from my father's side, used to be great, great entrepreneurs and support a lot of the country during the wartime. Yeah, that's right.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 13:58

So, you grew up watching all that, you pick those things up and that's in your mindset. 

Dr. Huong 14:04

Yeah probably.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 14:05

Yes. Okay, great. One of the key things that entrepreneurs deal with every day is a setback or things not going according to plan, or sometimes failure. And so, I feel that another important mindset to have in this age of disruption is what I call as a crisis ready mindset. That means, if something happens that you don't expect or don't want, you're ready and you're able to deal with it. So when you look back in your own life, how you deal with crisis and what do you think have been the practices that you do, whether it's meditation or having an affirmation where you have positive self-talk that allowed you to always make sure that even when you have a setback or failure, you get back and you're back in the game. 

Dr. Huong 14:52

When I look back, I see that actually the difficulty are the unwanted things all the way happens, the way we deal with that is very important. For example, when I start my PhD, before that is a collaboration project between the Medical University and Karolinska Institute, and we already got the funding. But in my study, I need to build up the reference data for Vietnamese own density with the DEXA machine. And you know that in 2000, through the whole Vietnam, there’s a very rare DEXA machine, because the machine is a very expensive so when I found the DEXA machine in one big hospital, and I'm very happy because, “Oh, I have a tool and I can establish the reference data for Vietnam, and then we can have an accurate diagnosis!” But when I meet the director of the hospital, he told me that, “No, I cannot let you do this study, because I would like to save that data from my daughter, she also could use that data for her study.” I know that his daughter is my friend, so I just called her. I told her, “Oh, my dear friend, your father would like to save that data for you to do PhD. So, could you please tell me, in our country, do we have any supplier for this machine? Then I could talk to him to see is there any other DEXA machine in the country that I can access?” And then she gave me the phone number, and then I called him, and I find even the better machine, updated model for my study, and later on, actually my friend the doctor, as the doctor's hospital used one of my data for her PhD, not the data in the older one. When we deal with the difficulty, we find a better way, and we also can tighten the relationship.  

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 16:57

We close the relationship.

Dr. Huong 16:58

Yeah, close the relationship with our friends and people, and we do the better things. So, I think that when the difficulty come, we don't need to be worried about that, but we can collaborate with people to find the better solution. We really got better solution when we see things in different way.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 17:18

Yeah, it's so beautiful. You have called out two important points. And one is to have openness to view any crisis or a setback as an opportunity, because it can give you something better at the end of the day, right? So that's number one, and it's an attitude of mine. And number two, is that you also talked about how in the moment when you are navigating the crisis, if you can have a collaboration and you can communicate openly, you can actually get a better solution, and you can create better connection with people, yes, wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing that. I think it'll be really very valuable for people to hear that example and in how they can deal with crisis. Let me just move on to a new topic. What is spirituality for you, and where are you in that journey?

Dr. Huong 18:12

From my philosophy, I really believe in the cause and effect if we do the good things. I was born in the family that my aunty follows Buddhism. When she practised Buddhism during her time, because we stay very close to each other, so I just naturally influenced by Buddhism. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 18:36

And how do you practise that on a day-to-day basis?

Dr. Huong 18:40

In my family, we also have the place to pray, to the Buddha, yeah. In Vietnam, in own family, we have ancestors, and in a certain family, we also have Buddha in the worship. In my family, we also have a separate place for the ancestor and separate place for Buddha worship.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 19:03

Oh, thank you, it's really the philosophy of do good and good will come to you. It is really empowering. And I can see that's what you practise on a day-to-day basis. So then, what about living a simple life? What is a simple life for you?

Dr. Huong 19:19

People think of high buildings and car and luxury life, but I think that actually in life, we just need enough food to eat. We need the clean air for breathing, and we need to have clean water, and then that we can be alive and spend time to think how we can help other people, how we can have the peace in our life, and how we can do the good thing to make life better, to make society better. The Simple Life is very simple.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 19:56

Right, and so, when we boil it down to having food to eat, clean air and clean water, we can see that actually our life is settled, then we can pay attention to others. Yes, because in this universe, there is us and others and the other beings, like the animals, so thriving is like a space where it's the opposite of surviving. Surviving is like you have no space or you're just restricted. Thriving is flourishing. So, if you look at thriving, what are you doing when you are thriving?

Dr. Huong 20:33

How we can bring the good thing that's right and spread the good thing to others.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 20:41

And next question I have is that everyone talks about Sustainability, and when they talk about sustainability, they talk about climate crisis, clean water, clean air. But in our work, we focus a lot on sustainability being the ongoing thriving of a living system, and we as a human being, the first living system, and it's our mindset is like how we look at life to allow us to be sustainable or not. So in your work and in your own life, how do you look at Sustainability?

Dr. Huong 21:14

I also very much agree with you that Sustainability first comes from us first, the first thing we our life needs to be sustainable. And in order to be sustainable, I think the simple life is a very important concept, because if we think that we need very limited resources to be alive, then we have a lot of space to do the good things, and when we do the whole thing, it doesn't mean that we need a lot of money. We need a lot of energy. If we just do very simple things with people around us and then spread it like a snowballing, then that is a sustainable life. So, if we see the sustainable life in the way that we bring the concept of a simple life, then we can save a lot of things for the world rather than focus on, “We need to earn a lot of money. We need a car. We need a building. We need many things.” But that can cause a lot of a lot of waste.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 22:21

Yes. 

Dr. Huong 22:21

A lot of waste, unnecessary. So I think one of the important thing is that we bring the simple life concept and healthy life concept and happy life concept, and for the healthy, for the happy and for the simple, we actually don't need so much other noise, yeah, other resources and that is a sustainable life, sustainable one, I could see.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 22:46

Wow. That is really profound. I really like how you describe Sustainability. And linked all of that back to simple life, healthy life, and happy life.

Dr. Huong 22:56

Yes, yes.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 22:57

It makes sense. Okay, I'm going to ask you some very quick questions. And the first one is, what's your favorite book?

Dr. Huong 23:04

My favorite book? During the Tet holiday, I brought a lot of new book, because now I really look at how to transfer the technology to the society. So, I brought a lot of books to see how the previous person who do bring the research result to the society, to see which way they go and how difficulty they could face and how they overcome, yeah, so that is my main interest there at this moment.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 23:36

I got it. Thank you. And what's your favorite travel destination?

Dr. Huong 23:41

Ten years ago, my dream is traveling around the world. And after I traveled to many destinations in five continents now, my real destination is stay in Vietnam and have people all around the world come to Vietnam. 

Dr. Huong 24:00

Oh, that's, that's excellent. And if you can have dinner with anyone, who would it be? 

Dr. Huong 24:07

Anyone? 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 24:08

Yeah.

Dr. Huong 24:08

I always like to have dinner with my family and my mom.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 24:13

Really great. And if you can have any superpower, what do you think you would like to have? 

Dr. Huong 24:19

I would like to have as a superpower that people live happily and healthy.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 24:26

If you can give it to them in a tablet, right? I'm sure a lot of people want you to have that superpower so they can live happily and healthily. And what's the best advice that you've ever received?

Dr. Huong 24:35

In my life? I must attract many people because the people give me many good advice. One of the advice is from my father that whatever you do is okay, but you need to be independent. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 24:48

That's really interesting. Was there any worst advice that you received?

Dr. Huong 24:52

I have one habit that normally I don't remember the bad things and the unwanted things. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 24:59

That's a good habit to live a simple life, don't remember the bad things.

Dr. Huong 25:03

So, when people ask me that question, I really could not enter my mind.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 25:11

I really got that, yes, I've come to the end of our formal discussion of this podcast, but I wanted to ask one last question, so tell us a little bit more - Do you have children? Are you married and so that we can get to know you a little bit more? 

Dr. Huong 25:25

Yes, I have husband and two children. My son is in the third year of university, and he study IT, and my daughter now is in the class eight, and this year she will see who has to take the national exam into the class 10. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 25:46

Okay, really, great. You talked about your grandparents. What is the memory that you have about them being entrepreneurs?

Dr. Huong 25:53

From my mother's side, my grandparents have a national historical heritage because that house used by my Uncle Ho Chi Minh stay during the war secretary and prepare for the war. So now our family donate that for the country to be a national historical heritage. And for my father's side, I could see those place used to be belonged to our family around Hoan Kiem Lake. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 26:26

Ah, yes. 

Dr. Huong 26:26

Many, many things in the past, but later on, we also donate to the country to become the public place, yes, to serve for the country. Those things can be in my eyes every day, yes, yes. 

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 26:41

Thank you for sharing that. Those memories of your grandparents and their legacy. 

Dr. Huong 26:46

Yes, so, I think that they are really wonderful because they not do each for themselves, not which for our family, but they can donate on those kind of things for the country during the difficult time. Yes, yeah, very happy.

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 26:59

Yes, you are very happy. And I think that's an important spirit to keep alive as we progress now, right? And Vietnam becomes more and more prosperous, and our people also develop. To keep in mind that we can also contribute to the public even when things are, not like during wartime, like in good times. 

Dr. Huong 27:24

Yes, whatever I do today, I still think that I can donate that thing for the society, because when we die, we cannot bring that with us, correct?

Dr. Ramesh Ramachandra 27:34

Well said, Dr Huong, thank you so much for being here with me this morning to do the podcast, I really appreciated the opportunity to look into how Vietnam culture and tradition have influenced you in who you have become and the work that you are doing. It's really inspiring. So, thank you very much.

Dr. Huong 27:57

Yeah, thank you. Dr. Ramesh, I'm really happy to be in the podcast.